Support group - Miscarriages

Hi tub,

Prof Mahesh mentioned that he is definitely able to help me. But maybe not the 1st try. If I were him, I also will not promise my patient. Dr are not magicians. They can't perform magic. But what to do? I understand that gynae at NUH does do ultra sound at every visit. So I'm not sure how they monitor the growth of the bb in particular high risk mummies like us. Whether to continue with NUH if I'm preg, I'm not sure. Maybe other mummies who are seeing NUH gynae can help to advise? I'll see what he have to say next week.

Also be prepared with high cost when you see Prof Mahesh. I've only see him once & I paid $1,300 for consultation & blood tests.

My son will be 5 yrs old next Jan.
 


hi Athen,
May I know if you have done any chromosome testing on POC for ur 4m/c? I've had 4m/c too.

I'm looking forward for my 1st appt wf Prof Biswa coz Prof Mahesh is fully booked.

Hi Tub,
I know what u meant.I am equally frustrated when gynaes told me:"well,try again,this is random,will not happen again" But why it is happened to me 4x!
 
Hi Avocado,

We only did Chromosome testing on myself & hubby. We do not have problem. None done for the bb.

Profs are obsessed with statistics. They need more samples for their research & analysis. That's why they did more test on us.
 
Tub,
Most gynae do nt bother much abt recurrent m/c becoz investigations of recurrent m/c is a complication process which requires collaboration with other areas of specialities such as endocrine,rheumatologist,which i believe most gynae might not willing to do that unless the gynae is ur frd or someone who u r close wf,who willing to do extra mile for u.

I am quite regret that it takes me 4m/c to realise there is a dedicated team in NUH to deal wf recurrent m/c.I shld hv go to NUH earlier than wasted so much times & $$ on other hospitals who r specialized in fertility treatment.
 
avocado, i also regret not finding out more about lupus antibodies and miscarriages after my first miscarriage. thing is, i should have done so because mine was a diagnosed case. but i chose to believe that it was a random thing, like what all gynaes would say. but apparently, it's not so random for people like us who have conditions. however, it's not too late for us. at least we are all doing some thing positive.

u know, the FIRST question my aged lady rheumatologist asked me when i saw her was: So how many children do you want?

i think she's hinting, albeit not so subtly, for us not to want too many. i told her... i just want ONE more. that's it.
 
Hi Girls,

I have cleared my blood tests for more auto immune disease.. *phew* So I have the TPO and have to live with that.. waiting for the Rhuematalogist call to decide next course of action..

Yesterday went to see my endocrine and he was rather reluctant to link the mc with the TPO numbers.

Tub and avocado... I guess we will all learn.. it took me 3 mcs to realize as well... at least you guys had a live birth. My only hope is the girls with recurrent miscarriages read this thread and so know there could be help.. We didnt know better back then and I am very thankful to read the newspaper article that point me to NUH..

Silent readers of this thread do seek help if you think there is any link to your infertility to such issues.

Lyn, SMS you ....
 
So ling, u don't have anti ro and la, which is good news cos it means u don't have to worry about neonatal lupus.
 
hi Ling,
I did a bit of researches,it is believed that TPO anitbody will cause m/c if the m/c happens in 2rd or 3rd trimester.My endocrine oso mentioned the same.He monitored my thyroid level very closely each of my pregnancy.My 1st preggie was fine under his supervision.

For my 2nd & 3rd m/c,i requested chromosome testings for POC & proven they r chromosome abnormalities fetus.

After my 3rd m/c,i decided to on hold TTC for a yr.My hubby n me used a yr to eat more healthy,exercise.But I still m/c this time.

It doubts me that i could conceive easy but yet our eggs/sperms r not healthy to produce good baby.The only thing i could find an explanation for ourselves is:We could not reverse aging/DNA.In the past,we led quite a stressful lives:jobs,kid,housework,inlaws prob,etc...that cause our eggs/sperms aged faster than usual??

I don't know....again...might be due to "genetic"???some ppl lead healthy lifestyle,yet,they suffer from illness n die younger than those who smokes n drinks?

Tub,
Ur aged lady rheumatologist might be thinking why did we all go thru so much hassles to hv more kids?The reasons she has such mentality,either her kids not filial,or some ppl just do not like kid.

My mum n MIL discourage me to hv another kid oso...For my mum,she worries abt my health,i mean DnC is bad for health.As my MIL,she simply scares that i ask her to help looking the kid despite i told her that i'll look after the kid myself.Part of another hidden reasons,their selfiness of me & my hubby not spending more times to care for them.Coz ever since my boy is borned,we r very occupied to look after him.

I feel sad coz they r not able to understand my situation n not being supportive everytime when i face m/c.So i don't even bother to tell them abt my forthcoming 4th m/c, since i won't be receiving any sympatise n consoling words from them.
 
Hi Tub,

Dont even know can have a live birth ever dont even dare to think about neonatal stuff. Sad isnt it.

It was to the newspaper credit and I think this thread will be good to let girls with similar predicament make an informed choice.

Hi Avocado,

Me too think they are link but already was closely monitoring my thyroid levels anyhow throughout my 3 pregnancies each of them I went to have blood taken every 4 weeks to see my levels..The first mc was in 10 weeks where the babies heartbeat suddenly stopped the gynae never mentioned do any testing of them because it was my 1st pregnancy.

For my 2nd and 3rd.. dont even have a chance to test anything because it was blighted ovum. Hence I think is much more than than simple chorosomal defect. I have also started the supplements regime... try to eat healthier and even any caffine related drinks are off my list. Not even sure if it aids anything... but we just have to try.

What I did know about some blighted ovum is that the antibodies didnt allow proper implantation of the ovum to the lining hence the fetal pole didnt even get a chance to grow and develope. Hence something have to be done to prevent it. Just trying blindly some ppl do have luck getting a successful birth but it is just too emotionally tiring.

Now is we need to hold faith I guess. We'll try... all of us.. we have come so far anyway.
 
Hi Ling,
Researches show that environment pollutions,pesticides,fumes,haze,lead in water cause chromosome defects in eggs/sperms.

Unfortunately,this is something unavoidable coz there r constructions,fogging everywhere.My place here oredi surrounded by construction of mrt,flats,condo...etc....Imagine the air we breathe...plus the recent haze fr. indonesia.

The m/c rate in China is getting higher so we all know the disadvantage of staying in developing country.My hubby n me even thought of migrating to nz for our health.

I've been so paranoid until i stopped buying food from China.

there r increasing number of couples facing fertility prob.

Yes,indeed,u shld stop taking coffee/tea(though i am still taking at least two cups of teh si everyday).I was a coffee lover in the past n stopped taking coffee after my 1st m/c.

Try to eat more organic food & take multivitamin supplement.Most imptly,exercise & be happy.

Saying is easy....doing is difficult...i just had a good cry after knowing that my HCG doesn't double.Quite confirm it is a blighted ovum coz the HCG reading is increasing in a slow speed.I've to accept the fact that the baby is gone.It is difficult,but life still goes on coz i've to be strong.

I am not sure i've the courage to try.The emotion journey of waiting process,the agony of seeing something we won't like to see from u/s n hearing what we don't wanna hear abt our hcg result...is tiring....

To me,drawing blood has become a painless process for me....i oredi immuned...the scary part is when i go into op room not to deliver a baby but fr dnc
 
Avocado,

I am so sorry about the news. I know the anguish and I hate it even more when I know I have to let go and have the feeling of getting used to the idea of having another miscarriage. Is like by my 3rd mc I was like... okay just be prepare this is going to end like anytime. The scan are just confirmation that I cannot be like other preggers ladies to move on to another trimester or whatever...

Would you stop your support with duphaston etc and just let a natural miscarriage happen? I find it emotionally less tiring and it is just like a big period with a lot of clots and my period took a shorter time to return. They presribled some cycotec for me to purge out the sac or whatever. I have done it twice and it was pretty fast. I had cramps, passed everything out and next day I was okay and no prolonged pain or whatever just like a regular period. I probably stop spotting after a few days.

I am not even going to bother whatever now.. I think is the immune stuff that is in us attacking our own bodies hence will await what the rheumatologist advise but I dont take coffee and limiting my tea intake still.. The past 18 months is hell for me and I am not sure I can stand it for me.

Everyone is asking what about kids what about kids... Hell I just wish everyone stop asking for once. My folks are only aware of my 1st mc and ald my mum is like ai yah dont want kids lah..because she get worried about my health. If she was to know I have had 3 mcs in total she probably make me tie my tubes or something.

Be brave avocado ... since the 1st appt ald made let just go ahead and see what they say. Pro Biswas is a repute gynae as well and not easy to get an appt I can tell you.

I dont know what to say but most of us been through this path and I know only too well nothing anyone says is going to make anything better except a successful pregnancy. =( You take care and we are here supporting you from this thread
 
Ling,
thanks for the comforting words...
happy.gif


I'll hv another scan tmr.If confirm not growth,then i'll stop taking duphaston.No gynae tells me abt cycotec,thks goodness u told me,how does it work?How long does it take for the cycotec to take effect?Overnight?or few hours?I don't wanna to scare my hubby wf bloody scene.

were u refered to rheumatologist by Dr Mahesh?

I can understand how u feel....even i've oredi hv a son,ppl will ask when u go to hv 2nd one.So sianz until i avoid CNY visitation.
 
For my last mc, which was last week, I passed out the fetal portion myself and dr cleaned the maternal ones for me. But be careful about not doing d&c though. Hv to be careful and ensure all is cleared. My mum's friend had to remove her womb as she had an infection after a natural mc.

Avocado, I know your feeling. I was crying my guts out 2weeks back when I knew it wouldn't work out. I just wish people would mind their own business and shut up. Not everyone want or can hv kids.
 
hi tub,
may i ask how long does it take for ur natural m/c to happen?Did Dr prescribe any medicine for u to trigger the m/c?was it painful?

During my last scan,the sac is 5wk,though i suppose to be 6wk.so i wonder how long does it take to dispel out the sac.
 
Hi Avocado,

I'm sorry to hear this very sad news. I understand how you feel. I had so MCs that I thought I'm used to it liao. But when I had my 4th one, I was really emotional & upset.

I was reading up a lot & know what can eat & what cannot eat. I was so paranoid that my mum also cannot tahan.

I was given Cycotec to soften the cervic the night b4 D&C. It helps to contract the womb. I experience slight cramp after taking the med.

When my gynae spotted some clots in the womb, he also gave me cycotec to pass out the clots.

Agree with Tub about a natural MC. Natural MC can be very painful like labour pain. For my last MC, my body tried to expel the fetus naturally. But failed. The pain was so bad that my face turned white & developed cold sweat. In the end, gynae did D&C.

For my 1st MC, the fetus was passed out without much pain. That was more psychologic pain than having to do a D&C. I passed out the fetus in my masterbed room toilet. I was so upset that I refused to use the toilet for weeks. I was upset that I flushed my bb down the toilet bowl. Till now, it was still painful though it was almost 6 yrs ago.

If you choose to have a natural MC, please make sure that everything is passed out & take care emotionally. Take care. We are here to support each other.
 
HI Ladies

Trying to catch up with all the posts here since my last visit.

HI Athen

I'm seeing A/Prof Biswas. I've only started to see him for my recent preg. I saw him once every 2 wks. For hi risk preg, usu they will see patient at least once every 2wks during 1&2 trim. As i have a huge blood clot around the placental (could be due to high dosage of clexane) therefore he scanned during all my visits until the clot is cleared. If there's nothing wrong he will only listen to the heartbeat w/doppler which only did once for me. From the heartbeat he knows if the baby is ok or not ... he said if there's something wrong with the baby at tat stage they can't do anything even if they scan. You can request to hv an u/s done to set ur mind at ease. It's ok to ask just hv to pay lor
sad.gif
. In his opinion, he doesn't want us to waste unnecessary $. It's not like private clinic where they hv d u/s machine in their room and they scan on every visits. I'm aso not used to it at 1st. Sometime he did a quick scan for me to chk d clot & told d nurse not to record so I dun hv to pay for d scan.

Hi Tub,

Thank you. Currently r u on medication for ur lupus? Does ur rheumatologist chk if u hv antiphospholipid antibodies? Lupus may hv secondary APS which means ur blood tends to be sticky hence causes blood clots. If u hv it, chances of miscarriage w/o treatment is v high.

Hi Avocado

Be brave and stay strong, prof Biswas is a good dr in my opinion. At least I feel more confident in him then peter chew and tc chang which I've aso seen + other dr for my past preg. He will tell u straight whether it's possible or not. What's ur chances like, etc. do ask him if u hv doubts he will explain.

My chances of having a successful and normal baby is not high but I hv not given up hope. LIke prof said.. we will get there 1 day.. that keeps me going. I hv to keep on trying. Sad to say there's only so much doctor can do, d rest is really depends on luck and god's will...

Here's something to share if any1 hv not noe bout miscarriage and autoimmune diseases.

http://www.rialab.com/miscarriages_prevented.php

I've read somewhere regarding IVIG therapy for antithryroid antibodies but can't remember d site. It is said that women who are antithyroid antibody positive who do NOT have NKa+ and or T-cell activation do not require or benefit from IVIG therapy.

Best of luck dear ladies!
 
Hi Lyn

R u having d antithyroid antibodies too? Hope d dr at Nuh will be able to help u w ur prob..

Hi Ling

Glad to Noe u dun hv other issues... So Izit likely u will be on ivig?
 
hi Athen,
i read thru ur past postings n found ur situation is quite similiar to mine
happy.gif


I oso hv been asking myself if i shld continue trying or just leave it to fate n settle for 1 kid. My hubby said he oredi given up,without his support,it is difficult for me to carry on trying.At the same time,I'm equally frustrated wf "unsolved puzzle" of my recurrent m/c.

I am oso emotionally drained after each m/c.i do not wanna see my family suffer bcoz of my m/c.My hb has to on hold his job n tak leaves to accompany me for appt.We've to arrange someone to look after my son.We've to keep making excuses to my mil why we r busy n nid her help to tak care my son.We decided to keep our 4th m/c fr. them,oredi very sad....not letting anyone to add salt onto my wounds.

May i know how many weeks were u in for 1st & last m/c? After hearing ur experience on ur last m/c,i wonder if i shld wait for natural m/c to happen....sound like very painful...I don't hv any spotting yet.I tink mine is only 5wk sac(blighted ovum).I can endure the labour pain but worry abt infection,and how long does it take for natural m/c to happen.I could not afford to wait too long time coz i nid to take care my son.

Jaraine,
r u still seeing dr biswa?it worries me when u mentioned tat i nid do u/s in another dept?I'll be seeing prof biswa for the 1st time this wk.

i admire ur courage.But u've take care of health.
 
for my 1st mc, which was supposedly a blighted ovum, i didn't see red at all at week 7. had to do D&C at doctor's place.

for this current mc, i was about 5 weeks. saw brown then red quite quickly at 5+ weeks. i didn't take any medication at all. there was no pain and it felt like normal menses. dr also din have to put in the medicine to dilate. he just went on to do the evacuation straight. i think i would have passed everything out without the d&c. i think it depends on individual. better to let dr check b4 deciding.

jeraine, for the ivig, did the doctors mention any possibility of negative effects to the maternal body and the fetus?

i can't remember what tests she ordered. but i'll see her next week to get the result. if i dun remember wrongly, my previous doc, LC cheng, ordered a test on antiphospholipid and it was negative. have to check my previous records. anyway, mine is a confirmed case of anti ro and anti la.
sad.gif


for lupus, i am not on any medication cos i have lupus antibodies but not lupus, meaning, no flareups, no symptoms... Lucky and unlucky i suppose. i had No signs at all b4 my girl was born. we had to frantically go through blood tests and all to find out the cause of the rash on her face. the puzzle was solved only when we saw a consultant at the national skin ctr one week after her birth. almost scared us to death that time. but my girl was born v small though. she was overdue (more than 40 weeks) but only 2.7kg and 48cm. another indication of the presence of lupus antibodies. restricted the fetal growth. but we were blissfully ignorant then... din take aspirin, din monitor heartbeat, doc din even check regularity of heartbeat during visits... din do anything... din even see a high risk doc! gives me the shivers whenever i think about it.
 
avocado, yeah... don't neglect your son! i'm sure he would want to have a happy, healthy mummy and to have your company more than wanting a didi or meimei. i'm sure the latter is just a bonus for him. given that kids today go to schools & enrichment so young, i'm sure they won't lack company. jia you and stay positive!
 
Hi Jaraine,

Not sure yet because I have not actually seen the rheumatologist. All the info was told by my endocrine who saw my blood test via this shared link between SGH and NUH. I am waiting for Nurse to return a call. *scare* If there is no treatment possible I am thinking will I continue having blighted ovum? =( lousy isnt it!?

Hi Avocado,

I have had natural miscarriage for my blighted ovums and wanted to have it as well instead of a D&C. To me compared to the D and C I recovered much faster almost literally because it was just like a big period and my hubby also said I have literally no downtime for both natural mc and I was about and doing my regular work as usual. However the first step is to stop all the hormonal support like duphaston etc.

Both natural miscarriage was about 7-8 weeks with sac size about 6 weeks hence I know there will be no fetal matter I will passed out but a sac. I just didnt want to do so much D&C because I am afraid of asherman syndrome and the process what I understood was not good as it is pretty invasive. However I make sure I have no fever went back to the gynae for another scan to ensure not leftover in my womb and I was cleared luckily. I agree with Athen and Tub to seek your gynae feedback. My gynae told me to go ahead with monitoring hence I was confident to let it come. Esp when you have sign of spottings already the natural mc will come even faster. I had the spotting on week 7 and everything just came. For me I also have had no labour pain or whatever.. there was some cramps I assume like a period cramp. However it is important to note it is different for everyone.

It also give me closure fast. I have had nightmares about my D and C and I never have let go of my 1st miscarriage of the twins and not a day pass where I do not think of them although it have been more than 1 year. =( However for the natural mc I somehow didnt really established them to be MCs although I know they are... prehaps it was because it was over like a period and the reality never did sink it my babies were lost..emotionally I was better off and didnt tear that much after it.

We are here for you.
 
hi Ling,
i understand how u feel.Losing one baby is bad enuff,losing twins is double the pains...

DnC is not only damage our bodies,oso scrap our babies into pieces?I don't know....that's how i feel...i ever read abt karma...the soul started right at the conception.Despite no heartbeat,he/she is still my fresh n blood.
 
i've had u/s this morn.The scan shows the sac has grown wf a small yolk sac but no heartbeat.Based on LMP,suppose to be 7wk but it is 2wk behind.But there is growth fr. 5mm last wk to 1.2cm today.

dr said it is not promising based on slow growth of hcg n sac.But there isn't any sign of m/c so dr asked me to ask bk next wk for another scan.

what else can i do but to "wait" again?sianz....i wonder why...could it be lupus that hinder the growth of my baby?Dr suggests i do a blood test but i wanna wait..coz i am seeking a 2nd opinion wf Prof Biswa tmr.

i've the feelings that the baby is healthy coz i felt intense cramping during implantation week.Could i be lack of something such as progesterone or suffer fr. lupus that hinder his/her growth?

my Dr said "they" were studying my case.One word that encouraging fr. him is:"don't worry,so long u do nt hv prob to conceive,no genetic issue,there is a chance,we'll help u"

if my preggie doesn't proceed further next wk,he'll prescribe cycotec to trigger m/c.He oso doesnt encourage dnc.

i told my hb i always feel like i am some kinda weird creature when such pregnancy occured.

Ling,
I understand how u feel...waiting game is physically n mentally drained n tired....at one point u hope miracle happens,at one point u couldnt stand the agony of knowing our babies r gone yet we couldn't anything to help.
 
HI Avocado

Yes I'm w/dr biswas. D u/s machine is in another room within d clinic. d consultation rooms do not hv d u/s only doppler. There is d fetal care centre beside d women clinic which provides screening of fetal abnormalities during pregnancy. That is where we do our 20wk antenatal scan but normal u/s is done within the women clinic itself. FYI, prof Biswas is a Dr tat does not put his patient thru unneccessary surgical procedure. I remember i told him i had laparoscopy for my endometriosis done w peter chew on my 1st appt. He asked izit big? If not big Y must I do d surgery. I went hm chk my record i found out it was only a tiny 4mm cyst! WTF! Now i dun blindly follow wat DR say. My last early mc in 2009 i tink at 6 wk, I can hv natural or medical management but he told me to try natural 1st, he chked my hcg and scan my uterus to make sure everything is passed out. He dun encourage d&c unless it's necessary. somemore i've done d&c several times oredy.

HI Tub

Gd tat u dun hv to suffer from SLE symptom. But I'm just wondering if u hv the lupus antibodies, will it become active one day?

Anti-Ro is highly associated with photosensitivity, neonatal lupus & congenital heartblock. I tink most likely u hv to be on medication for ur next preg.

Hopefully ur mc is just due to abnormality which can happened to any1 w/o underlying illnesses.

Side effect of IVIG could be headache and fever. there will not be any negative effect on the fetus. For immune deficiency where the body does not make enough antibodies, IVIG supplies them. For autoimmune disorders, IVIG will inactivate d abnoraml auto antibodies.

Meanwhile take gd care of ur health ladies. I'm also trying to `BU' as much as possible. Aso taking d supplements that LIng recommended.
 
I have no idea if it will act up one day. Will ask my rheumatologist next week. Is there anyway to find out if mc is due to antibodies or abnormality?
 
HI LIng

Dun worry, i'm sure dr will hv a solution for ur condition. finger crossed.

Avocado

Gd luck on ur appt w/prof tmr. Hope he has d ans for ur prob. All d best but if this preg dosnt work out, dun be discourage and dun feel u r a weird creature, we r here for u...
 
hi Avocado..

It sounds promising.. the reason why no heartbeat because it is too early you reckon? Wait for it to happen if it have to go we will let it go... Could be a late implantation or something. Hold the faith!!

Who is your gynae? He does have a lot of empathy!

Hi Jaraine, saw the link you attached in your earlier mail. It did mentioned those with antithyroid antibodies may be ask for ivig treatment before commencing conception ... However no known treatment absolutely what I needed to hear! Darn!

We are going mental with all these unknown ... =( We need a recurrent miscarriage specialist gynae in Singapore badly! Arrggh

Jaraine, must maintain habit of taking the supplements.. at least we minimimize loss due to bad eggs/sperms if you get what I mean... Not sure if it aids anything but at least we tried.
 
Jeraine, oh... Then cannot test already. Anyway, next two weeks seeing rheumatologist and dr mahesh... Eager to hear wat they'll say.

Avocado, nothing is certain yet so don't jump to conclusion! May work out this time! The waiting sucks but at least there's a chance!
 
Hi jaradine, yes i m tested positive for anti thyroid antibodies. The problem is i have never m/c or conceived yet so dun know wat the dr will suggest... Sigh... this journey is so dark and tough!!!!
 
hi Ling,
i hope i miscalculated the dates but quite unlikely,coz i keep track my LMP,O-day,ML date.Based on the conception date,it is unlikely late implantation
sad.gif


my gynae is fr. Raffles Hospital,he delivered my son.If u keen to know,i can PM u his contact.He is not specialised in recurrent m/c.I went bk to him coz if i nid to do dnc,i would prefer to do dnc at raffles compared to nuh,afterall,private hos is beta than structured.

hi Jaraine,
will Dr Biswa or technician do the u/s for u?

I was wf Dr peter chew for my 2nd m/c.Heard a lot abt him,i've frd who m/c treated by him.He gave some medications for her husband.Therefore,i went to c him.Unfortunately,he couldn't treat my prob,but at least he paid attn to my case n sent me for some tests.But i won't go bk to him coz of the long waiting times and...he always VERY busy.

I oso do not the svr at Gleneagles.When i woke up after dnc,i was quite blur n thought i just delivered the baby,so i asked where is my baby.The PHIL nurse simply threw the container of my POC onto my tummy & said:"there is no baby,just this" Damn rude.After i went bk to the ward,we lodged a complaint.They made the nurse to apologise to me,i rejected.I found her simply show no respect to me n my baby.

Few yrs bk when i delivered my son at Glen,their svr was excellent;with the increase of foreign nurses n their turnover rate,the svr is sucks.

Agree wf Ling that u muz consistently take multivitamin n supplements to improve eggs/sperms.Take more fresh fruits/vege esp organic ones r beta.Give ur body at least a yr to recuperate.Yoga will help to calm ur mind n soul.

Hi TUB,
U posted a very good question.Coincidentally,i oso asked my hubby if autoimmune will cause chromosome abnormality since it hinder the growth of the fetus,thus causes blighted ovum??But u might not able to know until we send the POC for chromosome testing or until we do the lupus blood test?complicated...the more i read,the more i confused.
 
Hi Lyn,
do u hv a endocrinologist?They may able to help u in anti thyroid antibodies queries.If u nid one,i can recommend my endocrine to u

but again,we might not able to find answer coz i realise gynae n endocrine prefer to work alone:p unless they willing to lower their ego to call each other to investigate various causes of m/c.
 
HI Avocado

Prof biswas will do d scan personally.

Peter chew is too busy running betw 2 rooms and he's v agressive w/drugs and surgery. My husb wasn't happy w/him so we changed dr.

I agreed glene used to provide gd svc yrs back, stayed there a few times... d last time wasnt a gd experience too. In fact I was surprised NUH was pretty gd from my last delivery, except u will see diff medi officers in/out of d ward but d consulting dr will visit every morn.

Autoimmune disease does not cause chromosome abnormalities.

Har... i can't wait for 1 yr...age catching up
sad.gif
..i afraid i'll hv more prob, i had enuf illnesses to hinder my preg. somemore every mc=time lost. i noe cant rush but i'll wait for 3-4 mth to try again. Frankly speaking, i dun really watch my diet, hate veg and fish and i dun exercise! Like LIng said, I try to take supplements to help improve eggs/sperm quality. Not sure if it helps but no harm trying lor.

HI LYn

If u planned to conceive make sure the Drs u see will liaise w each other on ur condition.
 
Hi Girls...

Jaraine, Cannot rush this kinda things...Anyway talk about eating lotsa fish and veg I take a lot of them as well but I think it doesnt matter. If you have an autoimmune disease I think all these do not help 1 bit. =( The fact is we need to nip the problem at the bud to try and bring down the aggresiveness of the autoimmune disease. I am just surprise that this is such a common thing with recurrent miscarriage and nothing have been done to test these asap. =(


Avocado, Late implantation possible leh.. meaning you thought it will implant day 2 but it didnt until day 6 or 7? Are you taking baby asprin now? I think might be a good time to start isnt it.

My take on chorosomal disorder vs auto immune disease. Chorosomal disorder ald have bad chorosome presence in the egg and sperm. While auto immune disease indicate possible limitation to an otherwise healthy fetus or having natural killer cells attacking the placental issue etc etc. Thus I really think both are different things.

About endo and gynae and even rheumatologist... I think I rather hear from the rheumatologist first... From what I read and hear most endo doctor dont believe high thyroid antibodies leads to anything and it shouldnt even be tested *blah* while the gynae will be the one going but there is no scientific reason but I really hope you just try again but I can give you the protocol in your case ie. progesteron support, folic acid, ustrogen, duphaston, baby asprin or herapin. While a rheumatologist will be one of the more garang one who will be interested to know why why why and dish out prehaps like IVIG, steriod etc etc. The above are personal experience with various doctors from the field of medication.

Goodness.. have half a mind to just go start studying to be a doctor! LOL!

Girls lets just have a good day today.. it is Friday. =)


PS: Anyone think we should start a thread for recurrent miscarriages? Not sure if we are scaring those ad hoc just 1 off miscarraiges cases at times when we end up discussing to this extend.
 
Hi all, may i know what kind of supplements and multivits you are taking and can we get it from pharmacy? Right now, i am only on folic acid and baby aspirin as told by the doc.
I went to see Prof Biswas after my 2nd mc and was told to do a blood test. He didn't brief me on my results and just told me to try again and go back in 4 mths time which is next week. Sadly, i would have to cancel my appt as I have nothing for him yet
sad.gif
Strangely they didn't even give me a copy of my result, i had to request for it. I am really confused on all those "antibodies" terms here, it's really as avocado said, more confused as i read..

My only concern with Prof Biswas is that his clinic only operates weekdays up to 5pm. What if i need to see him urgently or after work. I am already over 40s so i guess my only hope is with a doc who is quite well known for high risk preg..

I dread visiting this thread as it reminded me of what i've been thru and at the same time sad when i knew there are really quite a number of us here. However here is also where i can receive support and understanding from those who had been thru all these "i dun understand why me" ordeal..
I thought I could put all these behind but seeing and hearing my pregnant colleagues and sis in law talking about bbs on and on, i felt so angry and at the same time find myself so pathetic. I just hope they can be more sensitive and stop asking me to plan for kids. I am really thinking about quitting my job, far from those happy mummies and make "trying to conceive" as my main job, hilarious ya, i know we have to be positive but it's really easier said than done and i really admire the courage and perseverance of all you girls here.
 
Hi Paws68,

Here is a good outlet to vent actually. I can feel your frustration. Infact all of us on this thread can. =(

I think most of us here are exploring visiting rheumatologist to sort out if we have other underlying problem to this what I reckon is secondary infertility issue. Meaning the issue is not because of the uterus or ovaries but beyond that which might be for our immune system and blood issues.

I feel you shouldnt skip Dr Biswas visit. You should go and tell him your concern. He might encourage you to do IUI or better yet maybe link you up with a rheumatologist. they have a team in NUH looking at this cases so I think there might be hope after all.

I was also considering to stop working and concentrate on getting sufficient rest once preggers but I think we cross the bridge when we reach there. The likelihood of having expensive treatments without subsidize now put an intense fear in me. However if one can afford it I think it will be good to calm self and give ourselves a break.

In regards to supplements can you PM me? You didnt activate your Private message. I think I wrote here a few times already and other readers might just go sleepy =)

Do join us in discussion. I think it is enlightening what we have going. Make me feel... I am not alone on this journey.
 
Hi there

I have rummage d internet and books all these yrs for alternative med & herbs etc. d problem is i dun hv d determination to take regularly. Always stop half way. In d end i threw away alot of d supplements when expired! sigh..this time i must be persistent.

For my case, I already knew my medical conditions except that there's no known solution in d past until recently there's this IVIG thingy though it's not a 100% guarantee. I'm d first few guinea pig to do d treatment. By the way, i first got to noe i hv autoimmune disease is thru a comprehensive health screening done more than 10 yrs ago. Maybe those who plan for baby shld hv their health and genes chk be4 trying and also we shld be v well aware of our own illnesses, the type of med/procedure available, etc u will be surprise DRs sometime will missed out certain things. Afterall we r all human.

As for rheumatologist, i can tell u not all rheumatologists are trained in recurrent mc. It's a subspecialty they hv to take up. I've been seeing other rheumatologist in d past so i noe for sure. But NUH has d specialist in recurrent mc.

Oh by d way, I hv >20 boxes of 0.4ml Heparin (Clexane) expiring Oct/2011 to give away for free, it's quite ex u noe if u've used clexane be4. I'm now on 0.6ml dun think i'll need them anymore. PM me if u r interested.

Hi Paws68

I agree prof biswas is quite brief w explaination. He is not 1 tat will sit down & take time to explain every single bit of detail to u unless it's something really serious where u hv to make immediate decision. Maybe he think u noe d terms or he dun wan u to think too much into it??? I will ask him to explain if i hv doubts but most of d time i noe wat he meant so i'm always v fast in/out of his room. Diff Drs hv diff way of communicating. there r drs who still think tat we dun nd to noe too much or they tot explained we aso wont noe..luckily my rheumatologist is v patient and will take time to listen & ans.

I think most Drs at NUH dun give a copy of d results. I usu ask d nurse to make copy for me too.
 
Jaraine...

MUST TAKE DAILY!!! =)

Why you clearing your herapin! Dont you need it after you get preggers? It will be soon you know.. better keep it with you.
 
Here's a rundown of supplements women may want to consider which help increase fertility. Do check if the supplements interact with your medication or illness before taking and do not exceed ur daily requirement. Too much of a gd thing can be bad:

• Maca
Maca is an incredible fertility super food. It helps to balance the hormones, but does not contain any hormones itself. It is able to do this by nourishing and balancing the endocrine system. This is essential in preparing for pregnancy and IVF because healthy hormonal balance greatly contributes to healthier eggs. Gelatinized is the best form to use, as it is more easily digested than non-gelatinized. Gelatinization is a scientific process that removes most of the starch content from the crushed root, improving assimilation by the body.

The usual dose is 500-1000 mg per day (as per most bottles), either in capsule or powder form, although it can be used in much larger doses. It is a food and cannot be overdosed. It is said tat 3000 - 5000 mg per day is very effective, or about 1 to 2 heaping teaspoons.

• Royal Jelly
Royal Jelly is a fertility superfood which may help to increase the egg quality and quantities. Royal Jelly is the food that only the queen bee eats. What makes a queen bee the queen is eating royal jelly exclusively. She was an ordinary bee and then she was chosen and fed royal jelly and became the queen bee who lays up to 2000 eggs a day. It should be taken for at least three months before natural conception or IVF procedures begin.
Royal jelly is the Queen bee’s equivalent of hormonal stimulation. Take daily for best results. Caution:: If you are allergic or think you are allergic to bee’s or bee products, do not take royal jelly.

• Spirulina
Spirulina is a nutrient rich algae. It contains antioxidants, minerals, and proteins that help to alkalinize the body and nourish your eggs. Take one tsp. of the powder daily.

• Coenzyme Q10
Important for energy production. Levels of CoQ10 are lower in a woman who has experienced a recent miscarriage. ICSI fertilization rates may rise when taking this supplement. It also improves blood flow. It helps to maintain the eggs integrity by protecting it from free radicals. Coq10 is best taken for two to three months before having IVF or natural conception.
Dosage: (30-100 mg/day)

• Essential Fatty Acids
Very important to take when trying to concieve. EFA's act as hormone regulators. Omega-3 DHA and Omega-6 arachidonic acid are important structural elements of cell membranes, body tissue, and brain development in the fetus. EFA reduce inflammation throughout the body (a possible cause of PCOS and other types of infertility) and promote overall health. The best source is purified fish oil (don’t take cod liver oil as it is too high in vitamins A & D and may prove toxic). Start taking EFA's at least 3 months before you try to get pregnant.
Sources: Omega-3; flaxseed, oily fish, walnuts, green leafy veggies, and tuna (not more than 150g/week).
Sources: Omega-6; seeds and their oils.
Dosage: 700-1000mg per day.
Note: be careful if you are currently taking blood thinning medication.

• L-Arginine (16 g/day) is an amino acid that has been shown in studies to increase ovarian response, endometrial receptivity, and pregnancy rates in IVF patients who supplemented in large doses of L-arginine. Note: L-arginine will overstimulate the immune system, triggering flares in Lupus. Not sure about other autoimmune diseases, do chk w/ ur dr before taking.

• Vitamin A
Essential for the production of female sex hormones. It has antioxidant qualities which protects cells against damage from free radicals in the body. It also is important for the developing embryo.
Retinol (the version of vitamin A found in liver) has been linked to fetal abnormalities.
Sources: eggs, yellow fruits and vegetables, whole milk and milk products, dark green leafy veggies, and fish oils.
Dosage: RDA 2565 IU for pregnant women.

Beta Carotene is a pigment in plants that is converted into vitamin A. The corpus luteum is very high in beta carotene, so it may be cardinal in the regulation of the reproductive cycle hormones.
Sources: peas, broccoli, carrots, spinach, and sweet potatoes.

• Vitamin B1 (thiamin)
Needed for ovulation and implantation.
Sources: molasses, brewer's yeast, whole grains, nuts, brown rice, organ and other meats, egg yolks, fish, poultry, legumes, and seeds.
Dosage: RNI 0.8 mg per day (women)

• Vitamin B2 (riboflavin)
Deficiencies are linked to sterility, miscarriage, and low birth weight. The liver uses B2 to clear away old used hormones (estrogen and progesterone). If these are not excreted, the body thinks there is enough and less production happens, resulting in hormone deficiencies.
Sources: molasses, brewer's yeast, whole grains, nuts, brown rice, organ and other meats, egg yolks, fish, poultry, legumes, and seeds.
Dosage: RNI 1.1 mg per day (women)

• Vitamin B5 (pantothenic acid)
Important for fetal development.
Sources: molasses, brewer's yeast, whole grains, nuts, brown rice, organ and other meats, egg yolks, fish, poultry, legumes, seeds, wheat germ, salmon, sweet potatoes, broccoli, oranges, cashews, pecans, and strawberries.
Dosage: RNI 3-7 mg per day (adults)

• Vitamin B6 (pyridoxine)
Together with zinc, B6 is essential for the formation of female sex hormones and the proper functioning of estrogen and progesterone. A deficiency causes the ovaries to shut down production of progesterone which leads to estrogen dominance. B6 is used to treat luteal phase defects because of it encourages the production of progesterone. It also has shown to improve fertility rates if taken over a 6 month period.
Sources: molasses, brewer's yeast, whole grains, nuts, brown rice, organ and other meats, egg yolks, fish, poultry, legumes, seeds, and green leafy veggies.
Dosage: RNI 1.2 mg per day, but up to 50 mg may be used per day.
Note: Zinc is needed for its absorption.

• Vitamin B12
Folate and B12 are needed for the synthesis of DNA and RNA. These make up the blueprint for the genetic code of the entire body.
Sources: lamb, sardines, salmon, fermented foods that contain bacteria. Calcium aids in its absorption.
Dosage: RNI from 1.5 to 50 mcg per day.

• Folate (folic acid)
This should be taken for at least 3 months before conception, and 2 months after. It reduces the risk of neural-tube damage (brain and spinal cord) in the developing embryo. Vitamin C aids in absorption. The contraceptive pill depletes stores of folate.
Sources: dark green leafy veggies, broccoli, organ meats, brewer's yeast, root vegetables, whole grains, oysters, salmon, milk, legumes, asparagus, oatmeal, dried figs, and avacados.
Dosage: RNI 200 mcg per day (women)

• Vitamin C
An antioxidant that prevents damage from free radicals. Too high a dose (over 1000 mg per day) may dry cervical mucus.
Sources: citrus fruits, rosehips, cherries, sprouted alfalfa seeds, cantaloupe, strawberries, broccoli, tomatoes, sweet peppers, black currants, mangos, grapes, kiwi fruit, pineapples, asparagus, peas, potatoes, parsely, watercress, and spinach.
Dosage: 500 mg per day.

• Vitamin E
Deficiency may cause miscarriage. Taken with vitamin C may improve ovulation. Taken with vitamin C and selenium creates a healthy endometrium. Vitamin E has anticoagulant properties, so caution if taking blood thinners.
Sources: cold pressed oils, wheat germ, organ meats, molasses, eggs, sweet potatoes, leafy veggies, nuts, seeds, whole grains, and avacados.
Dosage: 400 IU per day

• Iron
Iron helps prevent miscarriage. Anemia can lead to infertility. Women who bleed profusely may be anemic, those who rarely bleed may in fact be either anemic or too high in iron. Tea, coffee, and tobacco all inhibit the absorption of iron.
Sources: organ meats, lean meat, eggs, fish, poultry, molasses, cherries, dried fruits, prunes, green leafy veggies, kelp, spinach, parsley, pumpkin seeds, sunflower seeds, broccoli, oatmeal, sardines, and nuts.
Dosage: 20 mg per day (only take if you have tested positive for deficiency)

• Magnesium
We need B1 and magnesium for energy production. Take with selenium, calcium, vitamin B6, and D to aid in absorption. Take with protein foods. Alcohol, tea, coffee, and smoking inhibit absorption.
Sources: kelp, green leafy veggies, tofu, legumes, rye, buckwheat, millet, molasses, brown rice, bananas, dried figs, dried apricots, nuts, barley, seafood, and whole grains.
Dosage: up to 400 mg per day

• Selenium
Deficiency may cause infertility and an increased risk of miscarriage.
Sources: tuna, herring, brewer's yeast, wheat germ and bran, whole grains, and sesame seeds.
Dosage: 200mcg per day

• Manganese
Deficiency may lead to defecive ovulation, and inhibit the synthesis of sex hormones. Manganese competes with iron for absorption. It is advisable to take manganese supplements with protein foods and vitamin C.
Sources: whole grains, green leafy veggies, carrots, broccoli, ginger, legumes, nuts, pineapples, eggs, oats, and rye.
Dosage: RNI 1.4 mg per day

• Zinc
Deficiencies of Zinc are quite common. Zinc is important for the cell division in the fetus, producing good quality eggs, and maintaining the menstrual cycle. Alcohol and the contraceptive pill deplete zinc in the body. Folic acid, tea, coffee, high fiber intake, and iron may inhibit absorption. Vitamin B6 and C may aid absorption.
Sources: lean meat, fish, seafood, chicken, eggs, pumpkin and sunflower seeds, rye, oats, whole grains, legumes, ginger, parsley, mushrooms, brewer's yeast, and wheat germ.
Dosage: RNI 7 mg per day (women), up to 30 mg may be recommended.

• PABA (para-aminobenzoic acid) (400 mg/day) Some women have become pregnant with PABA. PABA is believed to increase the ability of estrogen to facilitate fertility.
 
Ling

I will...I will ;-) It's really a chore to take all these supplements & medi. Hv to remember what has to be taken be4 or after meals. What to be or not to be taken together. Oh & thks for d info for d supplements. Already got them.

I will be on 0.5ml if I'm preg. Was on 0.8ml last preg but prof say too hi tat's y i got blood clot ard d placental though Dr vasoo dun think. But i agree w/prof. Maybe I will just keep it for awhile more like for another 3-4 mth. Will post again then, anyway it's only expire in Oct next yr.
 
hi Ladies

Sorry i am not regular on forum. Recently went to hide for a while, trying to find peace within.

Wow, there seems like alot of tests to go for. I am confused! Sigh, dont know where to start.
 
Jaraine, thats a very good list of supplements! Usually multivits like conceive well gold should have. But maca and spirulina abit hard to get hor? I think spirulina can buy off the shelf?

I am also on vitex, flown it in from overseas cuz singapore stop selling.
 
hey ladies, which rheumatologist do you guys visit in NUH for recurrent MC? can let me know so i can request for appt too? thanks.
happy.gif
 


Paws *hugs* i can totally understand how you feel! For me not only i feel "why me? why when i dont do bad deeds, dont lead unhealthy lifestyle etc ?" i also dont have good eggs i believe. So i am the difficult to get preggy then difficult to keep pregnancies kind. Its 2x the challenge for me.

Avocado, hoping for you its just later implantation! Meanwhile still take care as though preggy ya? I have a friend after 9 weeks then see heartbeat you know. So its not impossible. Now she given birth le, baby completely fine.
 

Back
Top